Forest London Day

[coughingbear]

Sorry about the delay in writing this up, have only just had time to do it.

We gathered at St Botolph’s Bishopsgate on Saturday morning May 21st, and hung around in the churchyard until it was time for the Mass. I stuck my head around the kitchen door to offer help, but it was already full of eager hands chopping fruit and suchlike, so I stowed the Special Chocolate Cake and left. St Botolph's is a lovely church, though I can’t find a picture of the interior for you. Father Nicolas du Chaxel celebrated the Tridentine Mass, and the choir sang the Byrd Mass for Four Voices, his Ave verum and the chant beautifully. There was a slight shortage of Mass books so we had to share, though as often seems to be the case with missals/mass sheets it was pretty difficult to work out where we were in the service anyway and how many pages to skip for the next bit. First time I’d been to a Tridentine service since I was very young, but I can’t say it had the same effect on me as on Nicola, I don’t think I’d be hooked if I went again. Fr Nicolas preached a short sermon on the importance of artists and writers like Antonia Forest, and we finished up by singing The Lord’s My Shepherd. There was a collection at the end, half for the church and half for the RNLI.

Then it was time for people to register and have lunch; while queuing I chatted to liadnan and frankie_ecap, about among other things exactly what Antiochian Orthodoxy is, we having noticed that they have services at St Botolph’s. It turned out that one of the women ahead of us in the queue was Antiochian Orthodox, and she told us about their Patriarch in Damascus, Ignatius IV.

Eventually everyone got seated in the church hall; a woman sitting near me had brought along a letter she’d received from AF, though I can’t make any revelations because I didn’t get a chance to read it properly. Hope to see one of the people who did tonight, so may report further later. We discussed the future lives of Nicola and Patrick (‘My first crush! You can't slash him!’, explained someone), including whether Nicola might marry Robert Anquetil (edited to correct his name, thanks to jediowl), and some of the ideas in the ODNB entry for Nicola that a few of us put together a while ago.

Another letter, and a photograph of AF as a girl, were prizes in the raffle; I won a British Library CD of Elizabethan music. Lunch was very good, and finished with a toast to AF’s memory. Sue Sims, AF’s literary executor, then talked about AF’s life, and the extent to which it’s reflected in the books. She also passed around a photo of AF’s father, Ernest Rubinstein (AF’s real name was Patricia Rubinstein), and AF at her bat mitzvah. Hilary Clare then discussed AF’s place in children’s literature of the period, quoting Victor Watson’s ‘Jane Austen has gone missing’. We all agreed her place is high, natch! frankie_ecap took notes and is going to report on this bit in more detail.

And then it was time to drag everyone out on the ‘Nicholas Marlow’s London’ walk; I had a group of about 12 people, including liadnan and frankie_ecap, who despite the rather mixed weather cheerfully (I think!) walked our route around the City, admiring the statues of beatified chartered accountants in Great Swan Alley, visiting the monument to Hemings and Condell in St Mary Aldermanbury, getting soaked as we stood at the site of Paul’s Cross in St Paul’s Churchyard, and remembering Nicholas seeing the preachers there, and meeting Humfrey, and trying to imagine the bookshops like the Phoenix Restored where Lloyd’s Bank now is. The rain eventually eased off and we walked along part of the Thames footpath, and saw the place where old London Bridge once was, with its entrance through St Magnus, where Nicolas rode into London with Robin Poley from Southwark under the gatehouse with the severed heads over it. Finally we walked up Gracechurch Street (the route that Burbage used to take the timber from the Theatre to the Globe), and went to look at Great St Helen’s, one of the few medieval buildings left, and where Shakespeare was a parishioner (and defaulting taxpayer). Crosby Place opens off the same street, where Richard of Gloucester lived, but the building is in Chelsea now. Possibly the most appreciated piece of information I was able to give during the walk was that Cloak Street is probably named after the sewer which once ran along it, (cloaca = sewer in Latin).

Back to St Botolph’s for tea, where the chocolate cakes and gingerbread were disappearing rapidly, in time for me to rush off to catch a train to Oxford and others to do a rather fiendish Forest quiz, as set by Hilary Clare. I have a copy at home, so may put the questions up here for people to try - though I don't have the official list of answers.

Comments

[slemslempike.livejournal.com]

Thank you for reporting back - I wish I'd been able to attend. It sounds fantastic, despite the rain. I'd love to try the questions, if you can put them up.

[liadnan]

Eh, she have put me right about the Antiochene Orthodox not being the Syrian Orthodox, but she was wrong about the Alexandrian Orthodox and the Copts.

Oh, hmm, yes where were we.

The odd other male there during the mass but nary a one afterwards.

I have lost my quiz but Frankie may still have hers.

[widgetfox.livejournal.com]

Agh. Sorry - gave mine to prestonuk because she had to rush off and I would have scored about eleven out of fifty.

My report to follow in next day or so.

[coughingbear]

You did, and that's what I think I have at home (deduced because it's not in my bag). Am sure that between us this community can come up with the answers, but if necessary I have Hilary's email address & can get them.

[coughingbear]

Have found the copy of the quiz you gave me and typed it up, but think I will hold off posting it for a few days since the community is currently so active!

[widgetfox.livejournal.com]

The funniest thing about the Antiochian Orthodox woman was the way that she obviously thought there was something odd about our not knowing the details of this.

My ex-boyfriend once met the Coptic Patriarch of Alexandria, and was offered a chocolate from a tin of Quality Street. Seven years later, the surrealism of this still reduces me to helpless giggles.

[liadnan]

(Had a good day by the way: thanks due to you and the other organisers)

[widgetfox.livejournal.com]

Seconded.

[coughingbear]

Thanks! Will pass them on (am seeing at least one organiser tonight, I hope).

[ankaret.livejournal.com]

Thank you for the writeup! It sounds like it was fascinating.

I can't remember who Robin Antrobus was at all. Which book does he show up in?

I can't honestly wish I was there, due to not being terribly good with either organised religion, groups of women doing things in kitchens, or walking long distances, but I wish I'd been with the people who were there.

[coughingbear]

Robin Antrobus is in Marlows and the Traitor - Nicola goes off to meet him (and his boat) most mornings.

Must admit I was a bit worried in advance about whether people/I would have fun, but it was great to talk to everyone (and as admitted above, I avoided the group of women doing things in the kitchen!). Hope you're thinking of coming to the conference next year - I don't think organised religion or walking will feature nearly so much, nor will we be doing our own catering (I assume).

[owl]

Wasn't his surname Anquetil on Anstruther or something along those lines?

[coughingbear]

Yes, you're right! Sorry, I don't have the book here and was basing it on the DNB stuff we wrote. Will amend the entry.

[blonde222.livejournal.com]

oh oh oh I am so gutted I missed it! Specially as I am back in the UK in literally four days time. Would love to try to quiz, am sure I will do terribly. I thought Robert Anquetil sounded terribly dashing too. But surely way to old for N?

[coughingbear]

Well, his age is a bit unclear in the books, or at least in my memory of them, but I think he's not that old, maybe mid- to late-twenties Traitor, which might not matter once Nick was grown up. But in fact we concluded that she wouldn't marry him.

[blonde222.livejournal.com]

It could be like the Thorn Birds I s'pose...

Talking of which, I have also long felt that Patrick would go off and be a missionary monk. To misquote the Breakfast Club, wouldn't it be an absolutely superb way to piss off his mother?

Clearly Nick would be devastated, but unlike that that whinging Rachel Ward would practically channel her energies into something else ( though I am not so sure about Navy: I actually think that she would later find she liked the Navy more as a spectator than as a participant: I've always thought SHE would end up as the games mistress.)

Whilst, Gin would be devastated re Patrick, and go off and do a Princess Margaret. Rowan would marry Ronnie Merrick and together they would manage the combined Marlow/Merrick land (seeing as Patrick would have renounced all worldly goods, Ronnie would inherit it all). Ann would get married and be a vicar's wife teaching Sunday School. Karen and Edwin would have a very bitter divorce after she announced she wanted kids of her own and he said no. I agree that Lawrie would be a sit-com actress (deciding that you just don't earn enough money doing Shakespeare), Giles will continue to do well in the Service and command a ship in the Falkland Expeditionary Force, and Peter will not make it through Dartmouth all the way, drop out and become a photojournalist in the Third World.

[coughingbear]

I liked ajhalluk's speculation about Patrick's future here - not quite a missionary monk, but I imagine it would piss off his mother all the same. Agree very much that Peter doesn't seem fully committed to the Navy - though there's that future thought in Run Away Home, 'here I am, afloat', and I can't see him abandoning boats, though imagine he could quite well combine that with travelling around the world as a journalist.

[blonde222.livejournal.com]

Too right it would (piss his mother off). But I don't see Patrick lasting long in Ireland, somehow, I don't know why. I think he is secretly too much of an intellectual snob to spend the rest of his life as Father Ted.

[widgetfox.livejournal.com]

I'm not convinced that Nick and Patrick don't end up together, even though I certainly agree that he might not deserve her.

There's a bit in Run Away Home when Nicola describes how right the mass feels to her. (I'll dig it out over the weekend.) I've always read that as heralding her eventual conversion, since she's AF's totem character.

I like Ginty as Princess Margaret a lot. And I've also wondered about Rowan and Ronnie, although I think she might frighten the wits out of him.

[coughingbear]

Oh do, I was thinking about that bit when I wrote about the Tridentine Mass at the Forest Day, but couldn't find it quickly. I think Nicola & Patrick might end up together but I don't want them to. I like both of them, but he doesn't deserve her. But if you're right and the Mass bit foreshadows Nicola's eventual conversion, there's also plenty of actual stuff on how important Patrick is to her, eg refusing to leave him out of the Edward plot when Peter suggests it.

I think Ronnie might not want to marry someone who's more competent than him. (This may be a problem for Rowan with lots of people.)

[oursin.livejournal.com]

Wish I'd been able to be there, but what with impending travel arrangements thought I'd better leave the day clear for last-minute panics.